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New ambush spawns

Jim Pole Position Racer Renegade Group: Contributors Posts: 199 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 lol ......................... vet Posted Mar 17, 2010, 6:25 pm

*Lugal* Luna Sea Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals Posts: 2,246 Joined: Jan 27, 2008 simonmaxhill said: My other counter was "neener neener neener".  Nobody could stop me and that's how we took all-state and I became a local celebrity and then had a VH1 behind the music style fall from glory. I still have my issue of Tiger Beat with you on the cover.  ......................... vet marshal wv Posted Mar 17, 2010, 7:56 pm

*Grograt* Grograts Grunt Heads Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals Posts: 8,378 Joined: Oct 5, 2008 This is all too disturbing ......................... vet marshal wv community Posted Mar 17, 2010, 8:10 pm

*Rezeak* The Dark Knights Darkwind Guru Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Marshals + Storytellers Posts: 2,378 Joined: Aug 8, 2009 I heard that this thread was once about ambushes... kinda rings a bell... ......................... vet wv deathrceL1 marshal pvp2 zom pvp3 Posted Mar 17, 2010, 8:38 pm

Groove Champion The Groove Champions Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 4,813 Joined: Sep 16, 2008 It was about tweeners ambushing Tiger Beat cover models. ......................... vet combatL1 wv cont0,5,0 Posted Mar 17, 2010, 10:08 pm

*Bastille* Raging Scavengers Darkwind Guru Evan Reds Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 7,517 Joined: Mar 31, 2009 Quote: maybe the circle radius could be dependent on the scouting roll: high roll means that you are ambushing them, so the circle is large and you can position in the best place that will give you the edge over the AI, while a low scout roll means that you are restricted to a column formation along the road That makes sense, "We didn't see em coming". not sure how it would limit large squads and if some squads would not be able to set up in some situations, but it simulates the idea that if we do see the enemy we can use the high escape roads and place in crazy places, with a good scout roll,(like the road into shanty where you can place on a mountain). Would make a regular spawn quite nasty. ......................... marshal vet wv pvp4 zom cont pvp32,12,2 Posted Mar 17, 2010, 11:36 pm

Lord Foul .-^-HellRazors-^. Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Rules Council Posts: 3,543 Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Quote: Foul... I dont take a scout... It was always this way with ambushes... go and have a look at the scout where i lost two renowned buzzers and an osprey because a firetruck started 20 yards away... I lasted 9 turns. and guess what.. when i started taking blue text I surrendered... i lost the equipment but kept my 'uber' gangers. if you want to take a look in the hall of fame you will see a few VERY good gangers i have lost.. mainly in ambushes and in all cases they were the most exciting scouts i have done. And after losing them I have been a little annoyed but have simply trained more. The other day i lost the leg of a guy who is probably one of the best gunners in the game - 370 large guns.. 150 guns.. and it was exciting! I watched that event after it happened to you way back and remember you were forced to surrender to save your leader due to getting caught on an object. You took the risks by not using a scout and paid the price of taking that risk. If you had not been caught on that object you would have continued to fight to claimed that fire truck to claim your reward for the risk. But it also shows you don’t like to lose because you took the best way out to save your uber characters as equipment is far easier to replace. How much more annoyed would you be if you had lost your near 1000 skilled leader? Quote: darth wittered on and on about carebear attitudes but yours is frankly rifdiculous... if you want to make it so that you cant lose (or can only lose if you decide to go out in a symph) then this is not a game. For one you’re over exaggerating as there no mention of me saying I don’t want to lose. Everyone loses at some point, even I do. I find your attitude to make the game even harder frankly ridiculous. There’s no shortage of players losing battles and there’s no shortage of players losing gangers at every skill level on a daily basis. You may think I have a “carebear” attitude, but I look at the big picture and don’t base my comments on only my play style. I think of the less skilled or newer players with less skilled crew and lower grade equipment put into these new ambush code positions. I actually care about retaining players and building up the game, not pushing them away be making the game harder to appease a small group of players. You as a vet have the choice to make the game harder by various means, less skilled or newer players don’t have as many options and would have a far more difficult time with dealing with these type of situations. If those players are put into to many of these near no win situations to often and come up on the losing end to often, they will get discouraged and possibly stop playing. We don’t know if the new ambush code starts off weaker and becomes stronger the further south you go, but if it’s the same strength in all areas, then this could become a problem for those players. If you have a problem with me trying to make sure the game is still inviting for newer players and instances won’t arise to push them away, then I’m sorry you feel that way. But please don’t saying my comments are ridiculous when deep down you show that you don’t like to lose as well. Put yourself in the newer players shoes before jumping all over my posts. Quote: The idea that because you have invested in training gangers they should somehow be invulnerable is just ridiculous... if you want to see people win all the time watch a film. using buzzers and high end equipment should give you resilience in an ambush but it shouldn’t make you invulnerable. Nowhere in my previous post did I imply or say such a thing, why are you adding this to try and discredit my comments? Considering I have not used a buzzer since 2008 your comment is baseless. Many know I use muscle cars and racers in my wilderness scouts which can add a level of difficulty on its own. You chose to use buzzers to give your scouts resilience in an ambush, which clearly shows you don’t’ like it to be to difficult but won’t use a scout so try and pull rares. You want to take risks, but not lose your uber gangers by using one of the most invulnerable chassis available. Quote: You have always wanted this game to be ludicrously easy... you used to argue about spawn points incessantly in the rules council... if you dont want to lose stay in somerset. Just because I care about the game and retaining players has nothing to do with trying to make the game easier. I’m only one person expressing my views and if Sam examines those views and agrees with them great, if not I move on. Back when you were on the RC I didn’t “argue” about spawn points (Head on code) in the RC, I presented data to the RC and Sam to go over. There was a thread just like this one with players being upset about the head on code and I brought it to Sam’s attention. Sam agreed the head on code was to brutal and detrimental to the players enjoyment and modified the code to make it les so. I did not twist Sam’s arm to make that change but at least I made the effort to show how it was affecting other players because I actually cared. Simon: Quote: I've always interpreted the term "ambush" loosely in terms of how DW does it - similar to the initial deployment in table top wargames, it's an approximation that allows us to skip straight to getting to grips instead of having to manuever for hours and hours until we finaly get close. The cars aren't just "popping up out of the ground" - different groups, split up and hidden all over the landscape, harass and corral the travel/scout pack until they feel they've got them into a vulnerable position or are forced to engage. I think the argument isn't "this is unrealistic" so much as it is "this is too hard." I have the perfect counter argument, though. "No it's not." That would be an acceptable situation except the scout being harassed/corralled is not being allowed to fire its weapons until the enemy is well within weapons range. Add that the scout is not allowed to make any adjustments while being harassed or corralled. If they new they were being corralled or harassed, all efforts would be made to avoid a near no win situation. Basically the scout/player is being put into a position they have no control over. Now if say the enemy had a better skilled scout than you, I could understand them having the upper hand, but if they don’t and your scout knows the area better, your scouting party would be able to avoid such situations. Players put themselves in these ambush situations because they purposely don’t use/bring a scout. But the players that actually make the effort to train and bring skilled scouts should be able to avoid these brutal ambushes because of the level of scout used. ......................... vet race1 deathrce1 wv zom circuit1 pvp1 northernsummer community circuit3 paintball55,201,123 Posted Mar 17, 2010, 11:51 pm Last edited Mar 17, 2010, 11:54 pm by Lord Foul

*goat starer* Special Circumstances Darkwind Guru Evan Reds Faction Group: Contributors Posts: 10,908 Joined: Oct 29, 2007 Lord Foul said: I watched that event after it happened to you way back and remember you were forced to surrender to save your leader due to getting caught on an object. You took the risks by not using a scout and paid the price of taking that risk. If you had not been caught on that object you would have continued to fight to claimed that fire truck to claim your reward for the risk. But it also shows you don’t like to lose because you took the best way out to save your uber characters as equipment is far easier to replace. How much more annoyed would you be if you had lost your near 1000 skilled leader? foul.. you are entirely missing the point... even leaving aside your inaccuracy... (i surrendered because i breached and was taking internals - the obstacle was incidantal and even had it not been there i would have lost)... the basic point is that i DID lose... three of my best vehicles... and i ENJOYED it... i wasn't annoyed... because unlike you i seem to have a pretty clear idea that this is a game and games are only fun if you lose sometimes... In other scouts i have abandoned characters (take a look at them in the hall of fame) with gunnery skills most people have never reached to die because it suited the role play to do so. there is a massive shortage of players losing battles... you only have to look at people garages... and the strangely small number of people in that hall of fame to see it. you are not talking abput what happens to newer players .. you are talkig about what happens to you... trying to dress that up does nobody any credit. If your attitude to the game is such that you dont want to lose then fair enough... admit it ... move on.. but dont pretend its about making it 'inviting to newer players'. The problem has always been maintaining interest beyond a certain point not getting people to feel invited. the rest of your post is complete drivel.. you deliberately distort everything i saiod and as always debating with you is like talking to a self interested cloud. You started the thing about head on code.. nobody else was interested... it was the same as this. YOU said if i wanted more challenge i should leave my buzzers at home.. I merely pointed out that this type of change gets it bang on.. you can still use buzzers and still be at risk. whether you do or not is irrelevant and again i have no idea what you are trying to say because you never actually read anyones posts or reply to them with any rational argument. Sam has finally put some challenge into the game.. it is to be applauded. ......................... vet wv zom pvp4 cont community deathrceL1 marshal pvp3 pvp2 Posted Mar 18, 2010, 12:13 am Last edited Mar 18, 2010, 12:20 am by goat starer

Stingray191 Bladerunners Darkwind Guru Deathrace Mafia Faction Group: Members Posts: 678 Joined: Dec 9, 2008 Oh #### yeah there is some challenge to be had. Sigh - thought I had the right set up to beat front and behind but a small error in placement (and poor judgement) cost me a few turns and suddenly I was fricking swarmed. 5 dead gangers - thankfully only 1 I greatly cared about. But - still approve of changes. Gotta rethink again. ......................... vet wv elmsautumn e2g ww Posted Mar 25, 2010, 10:53 pm

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 Goat, there is no shortage of ganger's dieing... have you checked the Gazette anytime in the recent year? That High skilled ganger's aren't killed as much, isn't this obvious, people take better care of their higher skilled ones. Have you even checked the hall of fame lately? There are about 2 - 4 deaths per day, thats quite a lot considering it takes longer than that to train one. ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit31,18,0 Posted Mar 26, 2010, 8:13 am Last edited Mar 26, 2010, 8:15 am by FireFly

*Grograt* Grograts Grunt Heads Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals Posts: 8,378 Joined: Oct 5, 2008 But they all belong to Burden ......................... vet marshal wv community Posted Mar 26, 2010, 9:23 am

Bruv Ultra Catharsis Sunday Driver Renegade Group: Members Posts: 49 Joined: Oct 30, 2009 There is a fair bit of vets trying to decide what is good for everyone in this thread, so I will try to put the relative newbie perspective forward. The first thing I was told when I joined up was never scout alone. I ignored this advice and lost three gangers. This was fine because I was told in advance what to expect. I moved some gang members to GW and learned the hard way about the increase in the frequency of returns. This also was fine as it was my choice to up the ante. A while later I learned through the forums that ambushes were changing and would be more difficult. I kept scouting in the same way I had before and began losing/running away a lot more. This was fine until I was ambushed on a 2 car scout by a half dozen scorpions front and back starting at less than 100m. I got so cross with the game I almost packed it in. If I was a new player again and I decided having been told about the risks to drive my best gangers to firelight, I don't see that I would have much complaint in having them all killed. If I decided that me and another noob should scout SS and we get set upon by impossible opposition I would probably decide to play elsewhere. That said I would point out some things: It is very important that new players are told what to expect. Being killed because you took on something too big is far less annoying than being killed because you didn't know how big it was. Somerset should be easier than elsewhere. Some other MMPORGs have a literal sandbox where you can learn before being thrust into the wider world. I'm not advocating that approach but scouting SS should be less of a risk. If you want a challenge for your 200 gunner in his A armoured buzzer, go elsewhere. The best encounters are the ones where you are challenged, not killed in the first 10 turns, not destroy the enemy without taking a hit and not put the hammer down and leave the two landrunners chasing you in the dust. I don't know if you could code it effectively but some things just aren't fun, or are actively irritating/dull and should be avoided. This is getting a bit long but you get the idea. ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 1:55 pm

LoSboccacc Omnia vincit armor Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 523 Joined: Feb 23, 2010 I'd like too to see some more balance between faction strength and encounters, but that would allow for "mining" the somerset factions if they have their CR artificially limited (that was the main counter argument, last time we talked about it) still I totally agree that even if the wastes are a dangerous places and such one should have some way to make a risk assessment of what he will be up against. the way it is now the risk is proportional to scout level, scout area and somewhat gang fame and totally independent on what you bring to your scout. There is no "gearing up" for that difficult mission, there is no sense of advancement in getting better or more hardware. I mean, I see on the road kill ninja page that they have 13 gangers. what would happen should I bring 15 FT on them? ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 2:19 pm

Snakebit GridIron Greats Sunday Driver Renegade Group: Members Posts: 62 Joined: Feb 26, 2010 Bruv said: This was fine until I was ambushed on a 2 car scout by a half dozen scorpions front and back starting at less than 100m. I got so cross with the game I almost packed it in. Being killed because you took on something too big is far less annoying than being killed because you didn't know how big it was. Somerset should be easier than elsewhere. Some other MMPORGs have a literal sandbox where you can learn before being thrust into the wider world. I'm not advocating that approach but scouting SS should be less of a risk. If you want a challenge for your 200 gunner in his A armoured buzzer, go elsewhere. The best encounters are the ones where you are challenged, not killed in the first 10 turns, not destroy the enemy without taking a hit and not put the hammer down and leave the two landrunners chasing you in the dust. I don't know if you could code it effectively but some things just aren't fun, or are actively irritating/dull and should be avoided. Quoted for truth. Great post. There needs to be some way to ease into the scouting process. Death racing for 2 laps 10 times a day isn't it. ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 3:06 pm

iceman Sock Monkey Killaz Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Members Posts: 924 Joined: May 13, 2009 The way to ease into scouting was supposed to be scout with a Marshall rarely see the marshalls taking out new players scouting these days but most of them aren't active in SS to be fair so new players jus go out with other slightly less new players like SMK here or you or korn say I think it kinda works, although they more get thrown in the deep end with lil advice during the scout ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 3:36 pm

LoSboccacc Omnia vincit armor Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 523 Joined: Feb 23, 2010 well, as a noob I prefer just to attach* to whatever scout is going out, I don't feel like harassing marshal as they probably have better thing to do than babysitting me. there is a catch: scouting skill can be field trained only in wilderness, and until you don't have enough yourself you depend on others to bring scouts to your party and such - so there isn't a path that a noob may follow to exit from noobinesh, without depending from other players (don't read me wrong, I love group scouts) that is, apart from running from one place to another with a light unarmed car hoping for the best. but a single ambush in that situation and you'll need to restart from scratch. so we the noob are left to depend from other experienced players to grow up - which isn't bad but also mean that when there's nothing going on we're stuck doing nothing but town events, that don't train scouting so while entertaining does little to change our situation. * with mixed results ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 3:48 pm Last edited Mar 26, 2010, 3:49 pm by LoSboccacc

iceman Sock Monkey Killaz Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Members Posts: 924 Joined: May 13, 2009 Losho I think the way the game was supposed to work wasyou had to do a lot if courier runs to build up some good scouts after mastering town events and being proficient at playing a supporting role in group scouts then when they were 50+ you could start to lead scouts out of ss least ways that's what I did ......................... vet wv Posted Mar 26, 2010, 4:14 pm

*Ninesticks* The Wombles Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Marshals + Rule Council Posts: 3,371 Joined: Apr 11, 2008 Yep, courier runs/scout training will certainly help you build up your scout skills till you are happy to supply the scout. They train up much quicker this way than through regular scouts from town. In the alternative, ask a marshal to tag along on your scout and for them to leave their scout at home so you can train yours up. Hopefully, their knowledge, equipment and characters can help you deal with any mishaps. ......................... vet wv marshal pvp4 community pvp20,1,0 Posted Mar 26, 2010, 4:43 pm

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Bruv said: A while later I learned through the forums that ambushes were changing and would be more difficult. I kept scouting in the same way I had before and began losing/running away a lot more. This was fine until I was ambushed on a 2 car scout by a half dozen scorpions front and back starting at less than 100m. I got so cross with the game I almost packed it in. I wonder if this was not when the game started to get influenced a a player's exploit where he flooded the NPC gangs with billions of $$$, there by artificially increasing their fame and in consequence their toughness to beat on a scout or travel Just wondering because since around 2010-03-18 10:25:11, this game as been a mother for my best 400+ scouts, or maybe it's from something else (like putting your scout in a FT that greatly reduces his abilities?) Anyways on a solo travel (BL->SV) in a FT with said scout, got ambushed by 6 suvs and 1 muscle car Also trucing has been a nightmare of late, i'm guessing for the above reasons ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Mar 26, 2010, 9:21 pm Last edited Mar 26, 2010, 9:27 pm by *Tinker*

*Wolfsbane* Arbiters Darkwind Guru Badlands Truckstop Faction Group: Marshals Posts: 2,038 Joined: Oct 9, 2009 *Tinker* said: maybe it's from something else (like putting your scout in a FT that greatly reduces his abilities? This, I suspect.  The scout modifiers based on vehicle size seem to be massive - 50 scout in a flash is massively better than 100 scout in a Trash Truck, from what I've experienced recently. ......................... vet wv marshal pvp2 cont Posted Mar 26, 2010, 9:37 pm

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