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Engine v.123, Scripts v.274, new tutorial

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 The main thing in this patch is a new tutorial that should be much more useful than the previous deathrace-school. You can launch it from the Tutorials button in the lobby. Feedback welcomed    I noted a few bugs already from testing it myself.. I think some kind of wilderness scouting tutorial might be a good follow-up to this. There's also some other items that I'm pleased to have fixed, since they have been issues for a long time: 1. Camera animation fixed so it always ends at the correct position (previously it sometimes landed looking 180 degrees away from correct target) 2. Text corruption bug fixed! - this is one I'm really pleased about; it turns out it was a bug in the Torque game engine, not in graphics drivers. I noticed however that it's still happening in the over-car messages... I'll investigate. But if you see it still happening anywhere else, please let me know. There's nothing much more annoying than unreadxcfdxg tdfgd. Also I have improved the 'Follow Cam' so it should actually be quite useful now. I realised how important this was when watching my 8 yr-old son testing the new tutorial. He was fine with everything apart from camera control, and it got really confusing when his camera was pointed at the ground and he was trying to use WASD to see stuff. The 'Follow Cam' is now default - so will be great for newbies. You can unset it as default in Preferences. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 9:39 am Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 9:41 am by *sam*

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Bugs: “The event server has already started so you cannot enter it” message comes up when entering tutorial The character in Barney’s car actually has a random name rather than being called Barney! tutorial doesn't stop when you exit it. text corruption still happening in over-car messages ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 9:43 am Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 9:44 am by *sam*

*Bastille* Raging Scavengers Darkwind Guru Evan Reds Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 7,513 Joined: Mar 31, 2009 I think a 1 minute time limit might be good, so that you can have a good look around and read all the text. I noticed some of the text disappeared before I got to read it because I was looking at other things. Oh, is there a button to change camera angle up and down ( I think its page up and pg down, maybe one of the directions I missed because I was typing in the lobby)? Move camera up and down I know, but not the angle, would save me touching the mouse. ......................... marshal vet wv pvp4 zom cont pvp32,12,1 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 9:50 am

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Bastiel said: Oh, is there a button to change camera angle up and down ( I think its page up and pg down, maybe one of the directions I missed because I was typing in the lobby)? Move camera up and down I know, but not the angle, would save me touching the mouse. 8 and 2 on the numpad should do it. Also 4 and 6 on the numpad rotate the camera. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 10:42 am

ISHOULDCOCO COCO and the BURPERS Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Storytellers Posts: 1,440 Joined: Jul 5, 2007 Dude , you are using an eight year old for software testing. Slave labour. I am calling the social work.................... COCO ......................... vet wv Posted Dec 10, 2009, 12:09 pm

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 ISHOULDCOCO said: Dude , you are using an eight year old for software testing. Slave labour. I am calling the social work.................... COCO It would only be slave labour if I actually paid him. Muhahahaha, etc. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 12:15 pm

ISHOULDCOCO COCO and the BURPERS Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Storytellers Posts: 1,440 Joined: Jul 5, 2007 feedback We should see JD's message for longer - I could not read what he said - might worry newbs that they missed something Great map choice - great start cam postion with ramp in shot - very exciting Task 5 and 8 - the text spills over the dialog box and is hard to read after associating the machine gun with driver you might want to emphasis the assignment of the two by some means to reinforce it _ I just feel it is glossed over a bit too quick ( eg the key word everyone use assign  is not even mentioned) just my view though exit message is gone too quickly, after busting barney COCO ......................... vet wv Posted Dec 10, 2009, 12:28 pm Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 12:29 pm by ISHOULDCOCO

FireFly Anarcho-Pumpkin Privateers Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 5,468 Joined: Mar 3, 2008 *sam* said: ISHOULDCOCO said: Dude , you are using an eight year old for software testing. Slave labour. I am calling the social work.................... COCO It would only be slave labour if I actually paid him. Muhahahaha, etc. No sam, if you paid him, it would be Child Labour, you slavedriver  ......................... vet wv zom gateautumn deathrceL1 elmsautumn pvp1 pvp2 sssc raceL1 e2g combatL1 santa1 pvp3 gwextrav ww circuit32,18,0 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 12:29 pm

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 ISHOULDCOCO said: We should see JD's message for longer - I could not read what he said - might worry newbs that they missed something Which message? Many of them stay onscreen permanently until you complete a task ISHOULDCOCO said: Task 5 and 8 - the text spills over the dialog box and is hard to read Do you have Large Fonts set? I don't think it's a problem otherwise, and since small fonts are default, I'm not overly concerned in that case. ISHOULDCOCO said: after associating the machine gun with driver you might want to emphasis the assignment of the two by some means to reinforce it _ I just feel it is glossed over a bit too quick ( eg the key word everyone use assign  is not even mentioned) just my view though exit message is gone too quickly, after busting barney thanks coco! ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 1:02 pm

darthspanky McSPANKYS LOLLIPOP GANSTAS Darkwind Guru Anarchists Faction Group: Subscribers Posts: 4,008 Joined: Jul 29, 2007 all right enouph of the technobable i just want to know 1 thing whats thats 8 year old gangname we got some noobs to hunt for all the bad nerfs daddy caused muhahahahaha just please let it not be special circumstances i thought theyd be tuffer than that ......................... vet paintball wv1,0,1 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 1:40 pm Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 1:47 pm by darthspanky

ISHOULDCOCO COCO and the BURPERS Darkwind Guru Civs Faction Group: Storytellers Posts: 1,440 Joined: Jul 5, 2007 *sam* said: ISHOULDCOCO said: We should see JD's message for longer - I could not read what he said - might worry newbs that they missed something Which message? Many of them stay onscreen permanently until you complete a task Intial message in lobby before event launches - was up for about 3 seconds ( I have bold and large  fonts - yeah) thx COCO ......................... vet wv Posted Dec 10, 2009, 1:43 pm

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 gotcha, thanks edit: actually that message only disappears because event-loading screen opens. I'll see if I can make it 'stick' when that happens.. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 1:51 pm Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 1:56 pm by *sam*

Barbu Blackbeards Racer Renegade Group: Members Posts: 106 Joined: Oct 8, 2009 Hey, nice update there Sam! I just finished the tutorial and it may lack a thing or two. First, newbies should be initialized to the CTRL+G command and how it shows an approximate ghost if said car keep same speed etc. Even veteran doesn't always know about that neat feature. In the targeting part, I did not see any mention about the other targeting method, the right-click target one while in LOS and the right click one on the weapon but maybe say that the first method is considered the best. It's nice to see that you point the newest member at the more useful way of targeting! You should tell them about the fact that driver have a harder time hitting their target than designated gunner but for training purpose, the ganger you get should have the ''Deathracer'' spec. A little tutorial about the skill level and website utilities in the future could be something nice. Minor tweak: maybe make a single bubble when the head speaks, not a objective one and the explanation one but like a single one with objective written in red, when JD says that the guy wake up etc. there is no dot after the ''he he'' and finally, the jump objective should be achieved when the player is on the other side of the ramp, not in the air. Ho and before I forget, could there be a way to completely control the camera with the numpad? 7 & 9 could be the rotation, 1 & 3 the sideways camera movement and 5 the ''find your selected car'' button. There, it was my two cents. =P Edit: And add a line about the ''purple'' (accuracy) below the weapon in the manage window. ......................... vet wv Posted Dec 10, 2009, 1:52 pm Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 2:10 pm by Barbu

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Thanks Barbu! In general I'm trying to avoid over-cluttering or over-complicating which is why multiple targeting methods, specialisms etc. might be best avoided.. people are easily confused But yes, other tutorials definitely might be good. ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 2:14 pm

Barbu Blackbeards Racer Renegade Group: Members Posts: 106 Joined: Oct 8, 2009 *sam* said: Thanks Barbu! In general I'm trying to avoid over-cluttering or over-complicating which is why multiple targeting methods, specialisms etc. might be best avoided.. people are easily confused  But yes, other tutorials definitely might be good. You're welcome! Yeah you are right on that, maybe we shouldn't tell so much information to new players. As you say too, an ''Advanced Tutorial'' could be perfect for all those additional information. End of my commentaries. =) ......................... vet wv Posted Dec 10, 2009, 2:21 pm

Digital Monk Digital Fortress Pedestrian Renegade Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: Oct 21, 2009 Re: new auto camera features (This may sound gripey/whiney, but I don't actually mean it that way...) While I like that you now default to having auto-follow on (because I always used it) I actually preferred the previous auto-follow system. The way it used to work, I could get my view angle and distance set so that I could see a useful section of track and surrounding vehicles, and then the auto-follow just panned around as I moved. Occasionally I used Q and E to rotate the camera to keep up with my turning or to look ahead, but it was trivial. The new system constantly resets my height/zoom down so close to my car that I can't see whats coming up on the track or who's about to cause me grief. I've tried both relevant "Disable" options in the Preferences panel, individually and together, but they don't seem to change anything. My only option is to turn off auto-follow completely, which means I have to fiddle with 6 keys to keep my car in view instead of 2. What I'd really like is if you could separately enable/disable each of the three parts of auto-follow: position, rotation, height. I would probably use auto position and rotation, but purely manual height. I'd also prefer any auto camera movements to be purely deltas based on the deltas occurring with my vehicle. That would mean that I set up my view the way I like it, and then: 1. If my car moves 10 meters north, the camera will move 10 meters north. 2. If my car turns clockwise 15 degrees, the camera will rotate (around my car) 15 degrees clockwise (just to be clear, I'm suggesting the same kind of movement that Q would do, just auto-matched to the rotation that the car experienced) 3. If my car falls 1 meter down, the camera drops 1 meter down. That would mean that my view stayed the way I set it, while tracking my car around the field. Of course, I could change that view at any time, and future tracking would just go along matching the new view, because it's only tracking deltas, not absolutes. In #2, I'm only referring to compass rotations -- I don't want to tilt the camera when my car inevitably drives sideways up a cliff face My 2 cents worth. In the short term, though, I'd really, Really, REALLY like to be able to get back the old style auto-follow, at least as an option. Thanks! DM (And, since I haven't said it anywhere else before, thank you immensely for providing Dark Wind -- I've been trying to find something like this for 20-ish years now.) ......................... vet Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:39 pm

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Ok great job Sam! I love tutorials in games, it's soo super important to settle in calmly and breath and enjoy the (hopefully good) first experience. Now that being said i'm very critical, so here's my take 1. The first bubble (in lobby) disappears too fast, didn't read it all, yeah would be great if it stayed longer , and had a start button, or stayed while the event automatically loaded 2. it would be great if the task bubble would not disappear every few secs,  (once you start going after the pick up) or is that because the counter counting down from 30 secs? which imo is way too fast, it should not count down at all, but due to event's not closing could it at least slow to 2 mins, provided that the player is told about the principal of the countdown at least. 3. in addition to telling the player the distance to the target, it would be great if it told you the direction (I found it quite stressful ) 4. at the start when you are told to gain some speed, i found it stressful that i was constantly nagged and told to hurry, give it a few more turn in between warnings. 5. The part about clicking on the manage tab,... what's wrong with adding a "or press [M]" 6. The part about clicking the weapon than the target, then next turn re-clicking the weapon and re-clicking the target was complicated and a turn-off, and! next turn i was surprised that it didn't fire! (was not set to auto-fire) I can just imagine the hassle, stress  and confusion this would bring upon a new player! plus having the manage window open for that just eats away at the screen real-estate. 7. Also just a few words I would swap to make it more understandable: Lastly there was a few bugs, 1. Wanted take the tutorial again and to take screen shots of the popups i missed but the event never loaded a second time, even after logging in/out, i had just the red "your event is loading" and the head, but no follow up, "like this is taking a little longer than expected, please be patient" EDIT: in the time it took me to write this, the head is still staring at me an nothing as changed. 2. maybe i hit space too fast but i hat a series of popups that looked like so: Lastly yeah great job, would go great with some nice hick voice overs, and great job, definitely think there needs to be a series of these tutorials getting more advanced, like car jacking 101 ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:47 pm Last edited Dec 10, 2009, 4:57 pm by *Tinker*

4saken The 4saken Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Members Posts: 2,282 Joined: Jan 1, 2008 Aside from minor quibbles I would say the most important thing on the tutorial would be to have it to where you are assured to not miss any text. For instance you might have to either press a key to continue (confirming essentially that you read all the text), have a "back" button to be able to re-read, or have the text scroll down in some way (for instance when the new text comes up the old text scrolls down and is greyed out but still readable). ......................... vet combatL1 wv1,0,0 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:54 pm

*Tinker* BibleThumpers Anonymous Darkwind Guru Mutants Faction Group: Marshals + Contributors Posts: 4,546 Joined: Aug 1, 2008 Digital Monk said: I'd really, Really, REALLY like to be able to get back the old style auto-follow, at least as an option. Thanks! DM (And, since I haven't said it anywhere else before, thank you immensely for providing Dark Wind -- I've been trying to find something like this for 20-ish years now.) yup same, and for the camera follow same it's anoying ......................... vet marshal wv pvp3 zom circuit2 pvp1 cont Posted Dec 10, 2009, 4:54 pm

*sam* The Salthill Sluggerz Darkwind Guru Renegade Group: Lead Developer Posts: 16,780 Joined: Jan 19, 2006 Guys, thanks for the detailed feedback Monk - giving control of the separate parts of the 'follow cam' makes good sense, I'll do that (plus give the option of using the old-style method) ......................... marshal vet deathrce1 paintladder combat1 wv ped1 cont slay2013 Posted Dec 10, 2009, 5:02 pm

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