Big Daddy Posted Mar 5, 2010, 11:49 pm	If not, I think that would encourage me to scout where I risk PvP. But I thought there was always a chance. I ask because of a couple of things. My PvP flag is Open. Often when I Process Arrival for my solo wilderness scouts, I get the No Return information instantly. Shouldn't my squad appear in the "Monitor Gates" list for a brief while so PvP attackers can consider trying to jump me? Or does it mean my scout just rolled a "No Return Chance"? Hmm, maybe that's it. I've been scouting Elms with a very modest scout and forgot that a 70 scout "drug attic" is in town and was part of that one. But another time, I did see my squad listed in the gates monitor as Arriving. But it also listed "Immune". Is that just because I can't attack my own squad - others would have seen "Attackable"? I'm leery of PvP on returns because I don't trust CR at all to reflect the weakness that I think a single breached side or lack of ammo really mean (especially vs a human).
*Rezeak* reecestensel@hotmail.co.uk Posted Mar 5, 2010, 11:56 pm	You can be PvPd on returns, in fact that's where the majority of my PvPs have happened. If a player is spying on your squads then when you've finsihed your initial encounter they will get a box with 3 options to chose from: Delay (This delays the squad to give you time to set up a squad to attack them with.) Attack (you chose a squad and atack them.) or ignore (you let them go.) There is then a roll and if you're lucky enough you will get to PvP them
Serephe Posted Mar 5, 2010, 11:58 pm	When targeting people, I've had the opportunity to hit them twice in a row (first encounter on a travel map, then when they do the return getting the option to send a second squad out) so I am fairly sure it's possible.
*Longo* Posted Mar 6, 2010, 3:56 am	Sam told me about 2 weeks ago that this had been changed, and you cannot get hit on returns. You will appear in the gates monitoring, but your squad will say "immune." Yes, I tested it...
Groove Champion Posted Mar 6, 2010, 3:45 pm	Why would you want PvP to be available on a return? Doesn't the weakened, returning player have a mjor disadvantage? Seems to me like the change mentioned by Longo is for the best? Just asking...
Big Daddy Posted Mar 6, 2010, 4:55 pm	Oh, I definitely agree it's for the best. I mean, hypothetically, you could have a good match between a fresh ambush crew and a squad returning with casualties and loot. But I think it would require a lot of change & complexity to the balancing system. It might be nice someday, but I don't think it's a big hole if only NPC gangs can attack on returns for now.
4saken Posted Mar 6, 2010, 9:38 pm	Longo said: Sam told me about 2 weeks ago that this had been changed, and you cannot get hit on returns. You will appear in the gates monitoring, but your squad will say "immune." Yes, I tested it... :[
Serephe Posted Mar 6, 2010, 10:45 pm	*Groove Champion* said: Why would you want PvP to be available on a return? Doesn't the weakened, returning player have a mjor disadvantage? Seems to me like the change mentioned by Longo is for the best? Just asking... Not all players are weak on a return, and the attacking player has less CR available on returns also. Attacking a good player on a return would be a nice challenge.
Groove Champion Posted Mar 6, 2010, 11:09 pm	I wasn't aware there was a CR adjustment for attacking on a return.
Big Daddy Posted Mar 7, 2010, 12:26 am	Yeah, what do you mean by that, Serephe? I understand that armor loss and weapon loss (at least when it's totally destroyed) will reduce the CR of the returning squad, is that what you mean - the attacker will have to match that lower CR? Because if you take any loot, I think even with decent damage all around, you're extremely likely to have a higher squad CR. The kind of things I think would need to be factored include: Number of crew in vehicle. A lone driver greatly reduces combat strength Amount of ammo remaining. Big discount for partial clips Engine damage Weapon damage Armor facings that would get a warning before launching the scout Crew injuries (Probably controversial) crew skills/specs. Fresh, I have noobs who are just spectators building some courage and waiting to drive loot. On returns, they're driving and potentially manning weapons. Is any of this already factored into CR? I'm assuming not from my comparisons of fresh and return CR. It's not only a lot of stuff, but quantifying it all in a way that results in reasonably balanced matches seems like it will be difficult. And it wouldn't necessarily all need to be included - I know the skill/spec issue would open a can of worms for CR balancing in general. But I do think it is part of the fresh vs return difference, really aside from the general issue. I think return PvP sounds like a really fun scenario, but as it is now, I think the returning player's only smart option (in most cases) would be to flee.